1993 Wellcraft tilt trim problem

P

palermo

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Hi,

I am having a problem with my tilt trim function on my 1993 Wellcraft 232 eclipse Volvo penta 570 Dula prop outdrive. The boat has one of those single handle mporse shifters that also has the tilt and trim controls up on the handle. There are 5 wires that go up to the 2 switches on the handle. I only get down function but no up function. When I press either one of the up buttons I hear a relay clicking behind the dash but the motor does not run. This boat also has a tilt trim module #857534 behind the dash. So it has 2 relays mounted on the motor plus the 2 relays behind the dash. The problem started when I noticed the white and blue wire that go to the shift control; got frayed and shorted out around the handle and since I fixed those wires I now have this problem with no trim up. I do not know if there may be a fuse or breaker or something I should look at or where can I start to troubleshoot this problem?

Thanks
Ed
 
I don't know about VP, but MerC has a Trim-Up-Limit switch back on the outdrive. Keeps operator from trimming above the limits of the U-Joints. There's a separate "Trail" switch that's only meant to be used when the engine is not running. If the Trim Limit switch goes out, MerC can trim up with the Trail switch. The Trim Down button brings the unit Down whether Trim or Trail brought it Up.

MerC has only switches forward, and two relays on the trim motor/pump assembly. Sounds to me like VP has switches forward controlling relays forward that then control relays aft on the pump. You could hear a relay clicking, that was not actually making contact. Or making contact but the relay aft isn't working.

Can you provide a wiring diagram, or exact Model Number? Also, how many wires to your Trim Motor? If it's Three-Wire, one's Ground and the other two are Up and Down. Whichever wire gets powered is the way it'll go. One side of the control circuit can be good, the other not, and it'll at least run one way. If it's Two wire, BOTH relays have to work, because they serve to reverse the polarity to those two wires. If one color's hot, it goes one way. If the other's hot, then the other way. But again, both relays have to be good.
 
The model is DP-C
I have the Selco manual and it has some wire diagrams but I do not recognize my exact set up when I view the different ones they have in the book.

It has 2 wires going to the motor.
 
For the real manual to download and save click the first link

http://www.bing.com/search?q=model+is+DP-C+manual+in+pdf&src="IE-TopResult&FORM=IETR02&conversationid="
 
quote:
Originally posted by alien1952

For the real manual to download and save click the first link

http://www.bing.com/search?q=model+is+DP-C+manual+in+pdf&src="IE-TopResult&FORM=IETR02&conversationid=
Click to expand...
 
Thank you for the information. The wire diagram does not show the black box trim limiter box that I have in my boat. I think that was an option. Maybe I can just remove that box and use the system as the wire diagram shows. Does anyone have any information on removing that black box.
 
Alien 1952 I do not have anything that looks like the photos you posted. IF the rain ever stops around here I will try to take a picture of the pump and relays mounted back of the boat in the transom.
 
http://s292.photobucket.com/user/maxum2550/library/Volvo%20Penta%20trim I have the link to the picture of the pump assembly. There are also 2 BOSCH relays #0332204150 behind the dash along with the black box limiter.
 
Test those two Bosch. Now owned by and branded TYCO, but always "Bosch." Both relays have to make up properly. Terminal 30 is the "hot" wire. 30 is connected to 87A when the relay is NOT energized, then to 87 when the relay's coil IS energized. This is how the two relays accomplish reversing the polarity of the motor's two wires.

So... Both relays must have continuity 30>>87A when idle and must have continuity 30>>87 when the relays' coils are energized. 87 is called "normally open" and 87A "normally closed." So when you push the switch to Up or to Down, One relay energizes its NC contacts and connects 30>>87. That's ONE wire to the Motor. If the other relay's NC contacts (30>>87A) are NOT making contact, then you have an open motor circuit. Push the control switch the other way, and the relay that got energized before now sits idle 30>>87A and the other relay's 30>>87 has to make up.

Needless to say, there can be myriad other problems, switches, connectors, wire itself, corrosion. But those relays are "persons of interest."
 
The four relays check out with the volt meter. I am going to replace them any way as they are only about $10 each. I think the problem is elsewhere involving the trim sender and the trim limiter box. The trim gauge reads full up even thou the drive is all the way down so that tells me that the trim limiter may be just blocking the drive from going up. The red light is lit on the black box limiter module and I think that means it thinks the drive is full up.
 
Well... glad you looked at the relays. Quick easy cheap fix when you hit a bad one.

Again, on MerC, the trim Indicator (gauge) and Limit (switch) are two separate entities. Gauge can fail first and Limit still work (meaning it can still be raised with Trim switch) --OR-- Limit fail first (has to be trimmed up with Trail switch) and Gauge still work.

I wonder why (your) VP thinks it needs that Black Box...?
 
The book gives you the information to check out the trim sending unit. IT has 3 wires when I disconnect it the gauge goes down and then the drive will raise and lower. When I ohm out the wires i get the correct readings. I recconnect the wires and the gauge goes full up. I am really confused now so I think my next step is to replace the trim sender and see what happens.
 
My '96 DP-S, different than yours, also has a VERY EXPENSIVE Trim sending unit! It's connected to a Trim Limiter, Black Box, that has to be SET. -5*, +15*, and +45 degrees. My Trim limiter can be taken out of the circuit for operational testing. Can Yours? I've had the following issues, twice the trim sender wires have fractured due to the movement of the stern drive. I had intermittent trim gauge readings, if the stern drive was in the right position it worked ok then quit. Another recent issue was again an intermittent fractured wire this time in the gear shift lever going up to the rocker switch. If I pushed the shift detent in and moved the throttle with the engine shut down I could get the wire ends to touch and make the stern drive go up or down. I reworked the wires as ALL three of mine were compromised. Hope this helps, Good Luck!
 
Mike,

I have no information on how to set and adjust the black box on my unit. IT does have two pointometers on it to adjust but I have no procedure on how to adjust it. I am not sure if I can take it out of the system to test. The Selco manual only shows it in the wire diagram but it does not give you any information in the text on how to test it or remove it from the system for testing. I found a used trim sender on ebay for $100 and I am waiting for it to ship to my house but as I said before my trim sender checks out with the OHM meter. I also had broken wires around the shift lever and that is what started this problem. I really suspect that the black box may be bad and I think it will be very expensive to replace if I have to but if it was my choice I would just remove it from the system and rely on the trim gauge and experience to make sure I do not drive the boat with the trim angle to far up. Does anyone out there know how to remove this black box limiter from the system?
 
Well I replaced the trim sender but still no change . IF I disconnect the trim sender the drive will trim up anddown so if it is not the sender then I am back again to the black box limiter module. I have seen some used ones for $250 and I hate to buy one and have it not be the problem. Does anyone out there know how to bypass this limiter module and just run the system so it will trim and tilt up and down?
 
http://s292.photobucket.com/user/maxum2550/library/Volvo%20Penta%20trim Go to this link for pictures of my trim limiter module.
 
Anybody have experience with the Volvo penta trim limiter box that I posted the pictures of?

Thanks
Ed
 
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