best method for laying out stringers?

wino

Member
Joined
Oct 2, 2005
RO Number
19181
Messages
52
What is the best method for laying out(as in drawing pattern,measuring) stringers? Mine were totally rotted and just fell apart so I have no pattern.Also it would be nice to know what the stringers and bulkhead by the engine looked like originally as I think someone cut a piece out back there.It is in a old MFG 19 foot deep V runabout.Hull ID MFG01630M73K-443B.ANy info would be greatly appreciated as I know the members here have done just about all there is to do with boats.

Thanx
 
It is the other way around-"stingers" lay me out.
 
Stingers? WTF! Please make a useful reply, as I could really use the help.

Thanx
 
wino.....a little humor? Lighten up.

MFG was originally made in Ohio and then moved to Union City Pa. so you might get some help by researching the manufacturer. There just be someone around with some actual pics or plans.
What year and model is this boat anyways?

On another note......if the stringers rotted that bad...is it even worth repairing? Sounds like an awful lot of work to end up with a boat that may very well turn out to be virtually worthless.
 
some pix would help. years ago I rebuilt a molded wood boat. I added stringers 30% of the way from the keel to the chines and knees at the transom. It worked.
 
I see my mistake now. Sorry Bliss.Don't know how to change spelling in topic.Tanqueray I have lots of humor but like you say this almost seems useless but it is all I have.Will try to post a few pics when I get the chance.Should have taken more.

Thanx
 
Hi Wino, Just did transom and stringers on my 19' I/O last winter. It's a glass boat though...I'll say I don't know much about MFG boats... For me at least, the rotted stringers were originally glassed in good, and I was able to get a measurement off the remaining glass for size and depth before I ground everything out and built new ones. Pics would help. The job is evil because of the mess generated cleaning everything out..once that's done, it's pretty straight forward though. Take lots of pictures before you get too deep and take lots of measurements. I ended up replacing my engine mounts also, so the pics and measurements came in very handy.
 
Keith2 did you just draw pattern on plywood and then cut it out?What did you do underneath the stringers, did you put a layer of fiberglass or cut an angle or leave a space?The stringers have some sort of a bow in them on bottom don't they?I don't think they are flat across is what I mean.
Boatrebuild024.jpg

Boatrebuild018.jpg

Boatrebuild019.jpg

Boatrebuild020.jpg

Boatrebuild021.jpg

Boatrebuild017.jpg

Boatrebuild023.jpg

Boatrebuild015.jpg

Boatrebuild016.jpg

Boatrebuild014.jpg

Boatrebuild012.jpg

Boatrebuild011.jpg

Boatrebuild009.jpg

Boatrebuild010.jpg

Boatrebuild006.jpg

Boatrebuild007.jpg

Boatrebuild008.jpg

Boatrebuild005.jpg
 
It probably would have lasted another thirty years except for the fact that they had allowed water to run through the center (hump) for lack of better word and it eventually soaked the foam and everything else.Can I totally seal the floor and just leave the bilge open for water to collect and be pumped or drained out? This is safe is it not? Or is there a reason for the water being able to get in and out under the floor?

Thanx
 
So are they just flat on bottom or are they shaped to the bottom of boat.What is best method? Should I shape them and then apply a large bead of adhesive sealant to the bottom to ensure full contact with hull or should I leave them flat and then apply adhesive sealant? Should I use plywood or just some 2x6 or 2x8 sealed with resin and fiberglass?The reason I ask about 2x6 etc. is that I can put in a ten footer and an 12 footer instead of piecing in the plywood with an 8 foot and 3 or 4 foot piece. I would really appreciate some help with this as I am ready to get the plywood or other lumber and get this started.I am rebuilding the swim platform today.When they put the holes through for the support poles they didn't seal the hole and therefore the inner lining of Balsa? was soaked and went through a freeze thaw cycle and started splitting the 'glass.This should be an easy fix as it is small and easy to handle.Help!

Thanx
 
Personally I would shape them to the hull so that the deck will sit on a flat surface, the better the fit the better the result. Some high build quick set adhesive with some flex would be my choice, I wonder about gorilla glue as it expands during cure. Some temporary planks under the gunwales’ would allow vertical jack wedges during cure. Probably better to notch out the lower corner at the transom for a drain. Limber holes were common in wood boats to stop collected water from rotting stringers. Consider a coat or two of resin on the stringers to keep out water but that probably wont work if you use treated wood which I would consider but it is usually very wet.

I dont understand the balsa comment. Is that in the transom? is the entire transom out as well?
 
Get that useless foam out of there, you can't even work the way it is. If you want to put back, your choice, its there for flotation, but at this age its probably saturated anyway. That kind of foam is like a sponge.

Use cardboard to make a template, then cut out the wood. Don't use plywood for stringers. Use a good quality piece of real wood. Were not talking a lot of wood, so for me I would not be picking out some cheap/wet treated 2x4. If you just have to go to the HD, then at least pick out a piece of oak or something. One continuous board.

You will need to rough up the glass where you are trying to bond to the hull well. Needs to be nice and clean too. There are different theories on how to let that board meet up with the hull. Essentially you want a good bond but don't want to create a hard spot. The easiest is just to use some peanut butter consistency resin to gap fill and spead the load around the edge of the stringer as you lay it down. This has the advantage of being material ready to then bond with your first layers of glass. You will also want to fillet the edges real nice where the stringer meets the hull. You could mess with something more flexible like 5200 as the bedding point. There are advantages, but honestly few go to this length. Up to you. Forget the gorilla glue. Get the stinger in place, filleted nicely on either side, then lay the cloth over it and start wetting it out to encapsulate. Take a squeegie after wetted out and get all the excess resin out of it. Don't try to reuse, just scrape the excess out into a pail. Let this layer set up until it gel's, then before it hardens, use a razor blade to remove the excess cloth. If you cut at the right cure stage, it will come out nicely and clean. If you go too soon or too late, or try to force it, well, you will learn why you wait till the right moment. Layer on at least two more layers of cloth on top of this and your pretty good to go. If you have to cut limber holes with a hole saw, make sure you seal them up with resin so you never have to do this again.

The easy way to dispense the thickened resin mix (peanut butter consistency) is with the empty caulk tubes. You can find them at west marine for just a few bucks. they are disposable. You can thicken with wood flour (thin sawdust), wheat flour (really), or cabosil depending on what is available to you and your budget. Epoxy is best, but even with inexpensive polyester resin, this job done right will never need to be done again.

Have fun.
 
I did a dry fit with everything and on a couple of occasions made a pattern with cardboard before transferring to wood. Wow, big job ahead, but definitely doable. My stringers were flat and made from 1/2" plywood. I replaced with 3/4". They "bow" but I held them to the hull as they cured with temporary planks like Bruce suggests. When you were ripping it apart, could you get a general sense for how the floor was originally constructed? It's tough to tell from the pics if the floor supports were sitting on the bottom hull stringers or not. If not, there's probably no need to fit them. If yes, it looks like an angled rip on the edge that meets the hull would be enough. Do the dry fit, see where you can clamp or jack things down, and adjust as necessary. You really need to clean all the old wood and foam out of there and grind down to clean fiberglass. I used an 40 grit pad for this. Has to be dry and clean for epoxy to stick. I would not use any other adhesive than epoxy personally.

I used west system #105 epoxy with #205 hardener with their #403 microfiber thickener for bonding the stringers to the hull. I then used epoxy with their #407 filler to fair the pieces in and glassed over them with a couple layers of cloth. I also used clear penetrating epoxy sealant (CPES) on all the pieces as a pre-treatment. Maybe overkill, but I only wanted to do this job once. CPES is a thin epoxy that soaks into the wood and cures and protects it from rot.

As for materials, I would use plain plywood. It's what most builders used originally and if sealed right works fine. If you need to create longer pieces, you can use multiple pieces of a smaller thickness than you need and stack and stagger them (e.g., for 1/2", stack 2 layers of 1/4" and stagger the joints). The epoxy with the 403 filler is stronger than the original glue in the plywood.

Seeing the condition of the floors, you should take a good look at the transom to make sure it's not rotted out also. Now's the time to fix it if it's rotted out.

Finally, you should get the book "Runabout Restoration". Great source of info for a project like this.
 
Thanks for replies guys I think I will take some from all of it and mix and match.Some overkill here some relaxed ares there that sort of thing.Oh the foam is out of there and I do have two gallons ready to go back in I won't need that much but that is what I ordered to have some extra I hope.The floor bottom has been hand scrubbed with degreaser and soap and water and then pressure washed to rinse until no sign of suds were seen and then once more.I think I will use solid hardwood boards about 1 inch thick for stringers and then lay 2 inch strips of 3/4 ply on top to screw floor to.1/2 in ply for floor.Tapped on transom and sounds good so -far but will take a hook to it and see if I can feel some softness.Pretty sure I would not be able to use CPES for that area as that is where all the grease comes through from lubing sterndrive. For the price we spend to buy these boats I think the manufacturers could take a little more care and seal the transom openings much better as from what I see they just cut the hole and bolt on the stern drive with some sealant and pretend that water will never get in there. Well thanks again for now and will try to keep you updated .

Thanx
 
pdecat- no the balsa was just in the swim platform.I am going to use plastic corrugated sign board for the filler in that and the glass over it.Alll the work will be on the underside but I will still like to do a real nice job to it.You know "pride of ownerSHIP"

Thanx
 
On the fourth picture down you can see where the floor was and the chine? above it closer to the carpet.If I mounted the floor higher as to sit mostly on the chine would it be at an uncomfortable or unusable angle? I realize the stringers would have to be adjusted to fit.Just wondering why it was mounted the way it was.Ready to cut stringers and I am holding back because I am afraid of screwing it all up.I made a compass to scribe lines on the plywood after I cut them approximately the right height to get the angle of the bow correct.Should I be very worried about it bowing out or being deformed?It is still on trailer and has the back part of floor still in place.Three feet approx.

I had to go with 8 ft. plywood because couldn't get any dry hardwood to fit full length.Where the seems are going to be There are bulkheads so I shouldn't need to laminate different thickness of ply...I hope..

Any comments and suggestions are greatly appreciated as always.

Thanx
 
Looking at the 5th pic (towards stern?) it looks to me like the floor was above the chine and supports were glassed to the inboard side of the chine to support the floor. You could do this, but it might be just as easy to put cross braces to support the floor, and rest (glass them) on the chines. Have you pulled the engine and outdrive? That rot has to go back further, and if it's in your engine mounts and or transom (also made of plywood in many older boats) you need to fix it. I would pull everything out to get the full picture. If the original stringer went the full length of the hull, you want to replace the whole deal with new wood and glass. Also, did you separate the hull from the cap? If you did, it's possible for the hull to bow out a bit unless you brace it. If you get your new floor in and then the cap doesn't line up with the hull you won't be happy....Finally does the boat have a belly tank? you may want to plan a floor with an access hatch to the tank so you can inspect it easily.
 
Here are some other pics of rebuild.Want to know what you think about using this fiberglass for floor and stringers(cover them).
Boatrebuild071.jpg


And for some weaker spots I would like to use something like this.
Boatrebuild071.jpg
shown at top of picture.

To better explain where I think I should mount the floor check out this pic.
Boatrebuild081.jpg


Boatrebuild077.jpg


Boatrebuild080.jpg


Engine area.I sent it to be refreshed although there was nothing wrong with it.
Boatrebuild060.jpg


Boatrebuild061.jpg


Boatrebuild062.jpg


Boatrebuild062.jpg

Boatrebuild079.jpg


Engine on trailer hooking up to engine stand.(mechanic by trade now disabled)
Boatrebuild069.jpg

This is hard for me.

Old seat frame and gas tank cover (2 of them).Changing from lounge seats to just standard fold down type.Not sure how best to build new frame and mount them but need to cover both tanks anyway so that will be close to what they will look like.Will need to have access to tanks so must hinge tank cover/seat mount to lift out of way.Any ideas on this or just keep it simple.
Boatrebuild050.jpg


Boatrebuild051.jpg


Keith2 No I didn't separate the cap. I did take out everything.I will be replacing everything with new wood and glass.And no belly tank.

Thanks
 
Back
Top