Hull speed question

VTBoater

Member
exMember
Joined
Sep 6, 2008
RO Number
30718
Messages
383
Hey guys,
The recent discussion about motors being overworked at certain rpm's got me thinking about the way I used my boat last year.
What should my hull speed be with a 31 foot sedan with an 11'10" beam?
Someone posted a link last year to a calculation, but it asked questions about hull design I didn't know how to answer. How much difference does that make?
And anything over hull speed, it is better to get up on plane and run at 80% wot?
Thanks.
James
 
Boats have two reasonable operating ranges below and above planning speed
yes above hull speed you should always go fully on plane. The engines will be less overloaded and fuel economy better. You can forget all the calculations and simply observe your boat. At displacement speeds you will have little or no bow rise and a reasonably undisturbed wake. As speed increases the bow rises and wake gets bigger until on plane the wake separates from the transom.
A small amount of bow rise is OK for slow speed operation but look to the wake for best information. A small wake means less fuel wasted pushing water but not making the boat go much faster. Realize that the engine is delivering as much power as the props can handle at any fixed rpm unrelated to the rated engine power except at WOT. As speed increases the boat is always limited by the amount of power the pros can deliver to the water. If you add enough power to spin the props faster then the boat speed increases. If you are the inquiring type plot speed vs rpms and you will see a fairly linear change of speed with rpms up to the point at which the bow rise and wake happens. At that point efficiency is decreased significantly.
 
Here is a link to that sort of questions....should be very helpful to you.

http://www.sailingusa.info/cal__hull_speed.htm

I have a 26' Campion weighing about 7500lbs, a fairly heavy boat to be pushing with the 350 Mercruiser she's got. We did a 500 mile trip a couple of summers ago, and I did the entire trip at just under 7 knots which is the calculated hull speed of my boat. She will do over 20knts. I have found the best fuel mileage for me is the hull speed. I will use about 1/2 gallon per mile at 1900rpm and 7 knots. After that speed I start pushing the bow wave and the next best thing I can do is get onto plane, or get the boat "on top" , or kind of get rid of the bow wave. This happens at about 3400rpm and 14knots, but this almost doubles my fuel burn.....or 1 gallon per mile. They say that any rpm or speed you gain over the point of getting onto plane is a waste of fuel. The added fuel burn does not make the added speed worth it.

The only time I get onto plane is if I'm heading out to my fishing spot, but that's about a 15 minute run. For anything else, I enjoy the beauty and serenity around me at 7 knots. We have a lot of "stuff" or debris in the water sometimes...logs or deadheads.....and these are much easier to see at 7 knots than at 20. And, if I don't happen to see the deadhead (which float JUST under the surface of the water) hitting it at 7 knots is MUCH better than hitting it at 20!!! That's kinda my take on it anyways! Hope that helps!
 
1.34Xthe square root of your length at the waterline. So about 7 knots for your Mainship. The optimal speed for economy is more like the square root of your waterline length, probably not much more than 5 knots for your boat. Isn't your Mainship a semi-displacement hull, though? That means it does better than most at speeds above hull speed. How fast you run your boat has more to do with how much of a hurry you are in and how the boat handles at different speeds. I believe you can run your boat at whatever speed you are comfortable with. A lot of faster planing boats do indeed plow badly once over hull speed, but your boat should be pretty good at any speed she will run. Our 1977 Mainship tends to wander a bit below 7.5 knots, she tracks much better when you run her a little harder, your results may vary.
 
Mainship called my hull a modified V, whatever that is. They don't even list a length at waterline, so it is difficult to say without getting out a tape measure.
I was (am) having a hard time understanding how my engines could be working harder and be more loaded at 1800 rpm over 3400 rpm. My hull tends to leave a wake at almost any speed in gear, maybe the description by Bruce above is the way to look at it, when the wake separates.
Fuel flow meters would be nice, but probably won't happen this year.
 
You should take note of the specifics: The formula is for a displacement hull. You almost certainly do not have a displacement hull. A modified displacement hull, or semi-displacement, or semi-planing hull, but NOT a full displacement hull.

The calculations for a "fixed definition type" are fairly easy to do, thus you have the online calculator for a displacement type. But more complex types need far more detail and work to give an exact answer. Or rather, a more nearly exact answer. All of the calcs will be approximations. Very good approximations, perhaps, but still, not an exact answer.

Having said all of that, I cannot conceive of a situation where you wold need better than three significant digits of precision ( slide rule accuracy ). The actions of seas other than dead calm ( plus the water temp and salinity ) will cause even the very best o calculations to get thrown out of the window...

But here are a few things to keep in mind: The hull speed of your boat will be between the square root of the waterline length and 1.34 x that figure. It is easier to get in the boat and make a couple of opposing speed runs at the maximum speed your boat will go without any noticeable bow rise. then average those speeds together for a usable figure, and call it "hull speed".

Riding "on the hump" is always a mistake. You will encounter maximum stress, as well a minimum handling and fuel economy while "on the hump". Usually, you will also have minimum operator visibility.

Planing is a "feature" of hulls than can plane. It allows a boat to exceed "maximum true displacement hull maximum speed", while achieving a reasonable fuel burn. Only a full planing hull, on a full plane, can exceed the fuel economy of a displacement hull at below hull speed. All others ( read this as "every boat you might see at your marina" ) have a hull form that is somewhere between full displacement and full planing. Any calc you do ( other than a full blown engineering run ) will only yield an approximation.
As for those questions, to which you did not know the answer, my response is: for that particular calculation, yes, those numbers are important.

Or you could do like the rest of us, and use the approximation formula, as well as empirical test data to derive a useful, real world answer.

And "stay off the hump".

--

Note: I am not flaming, but it is difficult to "speak in detail" without sounding like Sr. M. Attila on a rant.

The general question is answered simply, without all of the calculations: In any boat, operating the vessel without bow rise will offer best economy, as well as least strain on equipment.

A true displacement hull simply cannot exceed "hull speed" without truly tremendous amounts of energy. In practical terms, a displacement hull will never plane, but only dig deeper into a hole of it's own making as you increase the power.

Deep V, and "modified Vee" hulls are semi- displacement or planing hulls. They can exceed hull speed with "judicious application of power" to achieve a higher than hull speed velocity. The different types do this with varying degrees of economy, but all will first encounter "the hump" as speed increases, and most will get past the "water mountain ( what used to be the bow wave when the hull was acting like a displacement type ). Operating in this range is generally not desirable for many reasons, so it is best to simply exit that portion of your speed range promptly.
 
The definitive answers are available in David Gerr's "Propeller Handbook" but in a nutshell, look at your wake. Moving the boat takes surprising little energy but the wake it leaves takes a bunch.

Catamarans leave relatively little wake and claim fuel economies that are impossible for monohulls.

Just slow down until you're not "pumping" all that water. You don't need no stinkin' equations.
 
Each boat/with its load and hull form is a unique situation. The formulas for full displacement craft are derived from test tank towing of models. Very accurate and scientific for that situation but application to generic hulls and varying configerations makes for large variances. Fuel and crew weight is an important consideration. Observation of wake and running some measured distance trials as mentioned earlier is the best way for an individual to calculate specifics for his particular interest. I won't argue with any of the info that has been posted thus far. E N J O Y---L I F E I S
S H O R T.
 
I think the best way to achieve and observe fuel economy is to get flow meters then you can actually compare the readings to speed. My 40 doesn't push much wake at 4-7 knots the hump in my boat is getting over 13 knots. From that point I can run to 31 knots full throttle. I run heavy though due to the hardtop and battery weight that factory 40 Mainship Sedan Bridge's don't normally have.
Bill
 
Hull speed is indeed commonly calculated as the sq root of LWL x 1.34

anything above that and your fuel burn increase drastically faster than speed. It s not always easy to see unless you have flow meters. For instance on Charmer the 70 footer that I captain we have digital displays for the big cats and accurate flow data.

At 10 kts which is just about Hullspeed we burn about 18gph combined. If i bump it by just 1 kt to about 11kts, flow jumps to about 28gph. Push to 12kts ans it's 35 to 40 gph. twice the fuel for 20% more speed
 
Bruce, I think you gave a really good answer. Thanks for that.

Pascal, don't multi-hulls really screw up this hull-speed stuff? I'm pushing a 30', 7,000lbs boat around at 17 knots (that's 15-16 knots in anything over 2-3 foot chop) with only 100hp (twin 50hp outboards). We burn hardly anything fuel-wise (3-4gph by many years of records I've kept). The hulls are semi-displacement. We plane around 8 knots. Granted, we'd get even better economy below 8 knots (but I' just can't do that :-)

BTW, we had to give up on the Exumas plans. We're just "back in the Abacos". Not a bad fall-back plan in my opinion :-)
 
It's my understanding that the 1.34 constant is for hulls of "normal" proportions (whatever that is)... Long skinny hulls such as in a multihull need a different constant.
 
Back
Top